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+--- Thread: [Serious Discussion] Religion (/thread-26936.html)
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Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - 0Target0 - 04-03-2011
My friend, this discussion is not about you personally, it is about religion. I strongly believe religion started because they could not explain natural disasters and other phenomena. Religion is the answer to the question of life is something you can not explain. Religion is taking the easy 'medieval' option, it is easy to believe in God. Because of the credibility religion gains if it gives an answer to the people's questions, it is very easy to just believe anything religion says, therefore religion was the most powerfull way to create moral rules for society to live by.
It's hard to not believe in God, it's depressing to know that there is nothing out there and that life can just end in milliseconds, and nothing, nobody will remember this civilisation. Lightness of our existance. Its depressing to know that when you die, nothing remains of you but memories, there is no heaven or hell. Your body is given back to the earth, time continues. What is time? I mean physically, what is time. What makes it so that as you read this one second has passed and it will never return. We all have a deadline, even this earth, hopefully mankind will be smart enough to go to other planets or constellations before this earth ends. I know that thought is mind crushing and a lot of people want to believe that there is life after death.
Before you post more so called 'science' laws, please get them right, because just to inform you, there is more than one law in thermodynamics and all of them are applicable. Consider the maximum entropy-minimal energy postulate, this is an optimum and thus can create organisation. It is easy to take one parameter and say HAH! see this law is not correct.
I believe that all of us do not have enough education to properly discuss thermodynamics, for me this is by far, and for alot of people, the hardest and most abstract course I have had in my life (this includes professors and doctors thank you). I wish I could quote my mathematics professors about thermodynamics and physicochemistry.
Science has been constantly crushing the world image of religious people, sorry for that, but I like the real truth.
I feel that i don't need to read books about religion, since for me religion is obsolete and the people who write books about religion are most probably biased.
Disagreement about religious views is what most wars have been fought about during the ages. I strongly believe that there is no end to this discussion on this forum and it will only end in a fight again.
I think it is useless to argue with people who have arguments that cannot be proven, because it leaves the option open to say anything you want.
For me it's just fine what people believe in, just think to how you contribute to the world by believing.
I personally think religious people don't contribute at all, at least not on a long term.
Also Styl4, please don't get personal in argumentation, I just would like a rational discussion. Only people who are losing in debates get personal. Saying to people that they dont know much about religion is a pretty personal argument, what you are trying to say is, look you are not qualified to talk about this.
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - STyL4 - 04-03-2011
(04-03-2011, 05:27 PM)durrrr link Wrote: How can energy (if we talk about pure energy) is a must for evolution? Only various FORMS of energy are necessary and it's obvious.
And tornado isn't energy -.-
Tornado isn't even a closed system (like Universe is), plus the conditions are bad for living things.
But you know, if the whole Universe was a giant tornado with all the elements and everything, after years, life would probably form (adaptation).
Without energy there would be no Big Bang theory, didnt i say enough? and the tornado is just an example, i was talking about energy complexion which can be organised but can't create organisation, that tottaly disleads evolution. that is a MUST.
ok so 0target0, typically you got off the theme, and you call yourself a good debater.. getting personal indeed
there is more than one law in thermodynamics - ofcourse there are did i deny that? NO, so dont bother! HA! they are all applicable indeed, and they are confirm that evolution cannot be 100 %, not even 60 %, but evolution can be theory that leads to something that MIGHT of happen, but as i said, complex energy cant create organisation or so called intelligent design, even if there are 10 billions of years, we could not get to that stage as we are now.
"Consider the maximum entropy-minimal energy postulate, this is an optimum and thus can create organisation" - the complexion of the energies was needed for evolution and thats what theory states, that can BE organised but cannot create organisation and even if it can only to some point, we're on far too complex stage.
youre talking about thermodynamics urself, im talking about the law of eternal energy, not the law fully itself.
and ure talking about science crushing religion at some point. but as i stated, on afterlife view so far the Science did not breach it. if u read like 2 pages before this post, i did state why the Afterlife possibility has gone to the limit where it's taken as a serious debate.
"Disagreement about religious views is what most wars have been fought about during the ages. I strongly believe that there is no end to this discussion on this forum and it will only end in a fight again." - are u talking about Old Christianity and the time when Christ was alive? not really, but if ure talking about middle age then obviously people didnt want to be manipulated like today, so? obviously ure starting to ask 4k years from that if it really happent due to manipulations etc. that happent 2k ago.
"For me it's just fine what people believe in, just think to how you contribute to the world by believing." - indeed, thats why the way i belive is my personal thing, i did do a research if i even should belive and if its not a fairytale but as long as i personally know why am i doing this there shouldnt be a problem?
did i get personal? nope
but i personally dont think u can know much if u think the time of Jesus was the time of religion's massive abuse, because u cannot COMPARE that at all.Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - Gaahl - 04-03-2011
The discussion was starting to get interesting, but then I've got hit by a couple walltexts, stopped reading and felt like posting this.
could you make a shorter "tl:dr version" under your posts in next time?
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - durrrrr - 04-03-2011
(04-03-2011, 06:25 PM)STyL4 link Wrote: Without energy there would be no Big Bang theory, didnt i say enough? and the tornado is just an example, i was talking about energy complexion which can be organised but can't create organisation, that tottaly disleads evolution. that is a MUST.
Well duh, it's obvious to an idiot that without energy, nothing would exist -.-
Energy can't be organized nor unorganized.
And what the fuck did you mean by saying earlier:
Quote:the formation of the energy which is organisedHow can energy be formed? IT CAN'T.
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - Tuism - 04-03-2011
First, styla you didn't answer my question: HOW the hell do you know that "unfaithful" leaders who edited the bible millions of times didn't edit the main story of jesus being the son of God?
is there a certain method you use to know edited verses from non-edited verses?
please give a clear answer.
(04-03-2011, 02:01 PM)Daniel link Wrote: Religion, Patriotism, Race, Money, has served to make a controlled population in the hands of the people behind the curtain.
Now back to my story.
How could you actually believe in a man that we can't see but he can see us and everything we do, and made the earth like it is today, it's such a big lie all used to gain power, control and money yet they keep denying it, why ? scared to go to hell ? Why tell me one single reason why should i believe in God? and why do you believe in him, or Jezus.
i got so many questions that Christianity can't answer, still they use it as an answer for things Science cant answer.
- It's still not allowed to flame in this topic.
I'll tell you why I believe in God..
1- Without believing in God... am lost.
2- The world would turn into an evil world if people didn't at least believe in God, and by evil I don't mean killing only.
3- The word of God, AKA Quran, have evidences that it's really the word of God, also in by seeing the acts of Prophet Mohammad we find that some of them are miraculous.
which reminds: why Grim and Maka didn't reply to the evidence I posted earlier.
I'll tell you why you should believe in God.. Allah:
1- You'll go to hell, for eternity, and if you read the description of hell in Islam, I doubt that you even want to see how it looks like .. simple as that.
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - [SAE]Grim - 04-03-2011
(04-03-2011, 07:28 PM)TwistedDemon link Wrote: 1- You'll go to hell, for eternity, and if you read the description of hell in Islam, I doubt that you even want to see how it looks like .. simple as that.
The day you and me meet in hell im gonna slap ur face
The funny thing is, nobody will ever "Know" the truth about religion before they die. Then they either go into afterlife and experience it themselves but cannot prove it to the livings, or u simply die and stay dead buried in the ground.
All I know is that the day you religion ppl die , you're gonna spend ur time in the sand I tell ya(But can I prove it? No I think not. We'll have to wait and see lol). If there is an afterlife I hereby allow everyone in the world to torture my soul for eternity.
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - STyL4 - 04-03-2011
TwistedDemon, read m y p o s t. Jesus was proved to be real person, now the skeptics are saying he was a normal human being as we all are. you can get the sources by PREACHERS that were with Jesus on his journey like Peter, those sources shows you the Jesus and his story could not be edited but do not really proof that he had the powers(they said that too, even if they risked their life), but i truly belive that. heard about those scrolls? they were also found! i suggest you not to deny Jesus as i wont deny your religion, but trust me - it might turn really ugly.
Non Biblical evidence as proof for Jesus Christ (1 of 4)
DEA SEA SCROLLS CONFIRMS ACCURACY OF THE BIBLE.
as far as i know, possibility of afterlife can be proved, and after talking with me e-friend it got me closer..
(04-03-2011, 07:27 PM)durrrr link Wrote: Well duh, it's obvious to an idiot that without energy, nothing would exist -.-
Energy can't be organized nor unorganized.
And what the fuck did you mean by saying earlier:How can energy be formed? IT CAN'T.
ofcourse! then how was the complexion that we have today formed? even if it took 1 billion years, it isnt possible. it cannot create organisation. ENERGY was the KEY and in big bang's theory the beggining of everything
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - durrrrr - 04-03-2011
(04-03-2011, 08:45 PM)STyL4 link Wrote: ofcourse! then how was the complexion that we have today formed? even if it took 1 billion years, it isnt possible. it cannot create organisation. ENERGY was the KEY and in big bang's theory the beggining of everything
What do you mean by saying complex? Heavy chemical elements? DNA? Amino-acids? All those things FORMED. Chemistry + physics here, boy.
And saying that energy was the key is too abstract. Energy is everywhere you look, even you are, in some words, lump of energy.
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - STyL4 - 04-03-2011
DNA is just PART of complexion, we can discuss about planet's location, brains structure(thats late lol), the location of the Earth itself(its very exact) etc., RNA(same construction as DNA) just somehow appeard in that sea on the Earth in the evolution
you can notice THEN the Amino-acids formed, its too abstract theory because the chances are VERY VERY LOW! they did form after alot of amount of time, but it needed a start, and energies could not make it FORMED with that amount of organisation. evolution is theory with proofs that shows POSSIBILITY, no matter how low the chances are.Christianity!
Re: [Serious Discussion] Religion - 0Target0 - 04-04-2011
(04-03-2011, 10:07 PM)STyL4 link Wrote: DNA is just PART of complexion, we can discuss about planet's location, brains structure(thats late lol), the location of the Earth itself(its very exact) etc., RNA(same construction as DNA) just somehow appeard in that sea on the Earth in the evolution
Christianity!
Yes! The chances are very low that the earth ws created this way! So a man named god did it! Very plausible
